10:31 That was a great job moderating. I think Obama had it--not by much, but he had it. I think John McCain just looked petty for much of the debate. It ain't his year.
10:25 Great ending...to the McCain campaign. He's laughing because he doesn't know how much he's bleeding.
10:23 "That was vouchers Senator Obama. I'm surprise you didn't pay more attention..." Lecturing again. Condescending again. Does that approach actually reinforce the age problem?
10:18 I think that parents part is critical.
10:15 That eloquence attack is a nonstarter. It's a debate. You can't attack someone for being eloquent in a debate.
10:14 Why does McCain keep sighing into the mike?
10:12 The kitchen sink comes out.
10:05 McCain rambling...Obama swats him.
10:02 From Andrew:
"Maybe you ought to travel down there." C'mon, McCain, this is weeeaaak. And petty. And incoherent. McCain's veep only got a passport last year and McCain is attacking Obama for not visiting Colombia.10:00 Doesn't "Joe the Plumber" sound like a 70s porn star?
9:59 OK, now he turns to Joe the plumber. But he turns to attack Obama.
9:58 Look, he's looking at Bob. It's like he doesn't know the camera is right there.
9:57 One thing I just noticed is the Obama is--and has been--much more aware of the fact that he's on TV. Dig how he turns to the camera. McCain is caught in the moment. The battle, for him, is right there at the table. He doesn't project out.
9:55 "There isn't any doubt that Senator Obama wants to restrict trade and raise taxes..."
9:53 McCain can't stop himself from lecturing and condescending, can he...
9:51 More passive-aggressive. "I admire Senator Obama's eloquence..." It just says you don't take the guy seriously.
9:39 You just heard why John McCain will lose. He pivoted from an attack on ACORN and Ayers to his campaign getting the economy back on track. Worst segue ever. The two don't line up. Ayers and ACORN don't take you to a larger campaign theme. This isn't "Swiftboating" which took you to the War on Terror. This isn't Willie Horton, which took you to crime. This isn't "States Rights" which takes you to busing and the Voting Rights Act. It's just empty demagoguery. It doesn't say anything about what is foremost in the electorate's minds.
9:38 Devastating. "Says more about your campaign, than it says about me."
9:36 "Destroying the fabric of democracy!" Who knew ACORN was a herald of Galactus?!??
9:35 Here it comes...
9:34 Damn, McCain looks angry.
9:29 Boy Barry pounded him on this one. The "Woe is me" BS never plays well.
9:26 WEAKSAUCE!!! We get whining about John Lewis instead of Ayers?? WTF?
9:25 Here it comes. I smell Ayers...
9:23 Good come back. He's steady as hell. It's amazing, even sitting down he looks erratic. It feels like that "I am not President Bush" argument should have come up earlier.
9:20 Good. Good. "Senator Obama, I am not president Bush." Said it looking right at him. I think he's learning kids.
9:16 Is the "buying up mortgages" idea popular? Who is the constituency for this?
9:10 Again with Joe the plumber! McCain should stop laughing and smirking when he doesn't actually mean it. It telegraphs passive-aggressive.
9:09 Barry's smooth, slipping punches "I think he's been watching some McCain ads," and then coming back and countering with "the plumber, the nurse, the firefighter..."
9:07 Finally McCain talks to him. Good move, I think. Oh, but the turning to the camera to talk to "Joe the plumber," not so much.
9:05 Still, something more than "Cut taxes." Respect due.
9:03 Ugh "Americans are innocent victims." No we aren't. But I guess it's what people want to hear.
The Beautiful Struggle: A Father, Two Sons, and an Unlikely Road to Manhood 
John seems to want Americans to be angry for some reason...
McCain is coming out of the gate angry.
We need to know there's a floor on our housing value? No. That just prolongs the bubble. You can't declare that a house is worth the mortgages on it if no one would buy the house for that much!
Oh, look, Obama said 'middle class' and the dials went up! Surprising no one. Not that I'm disappointed by McCain's refusal to use the term, but this seems like a no-brainer.
McCain's gone to the plumber story already. He's down to only Ayers and Wright now if he wants to score points.
50% of small business taxes are paid by small businesses? Who pays the rest?
Quick, what are the dials doing on McCain's opposition to "spread the wealth around"? Sounds like trickle down, which I don't see anyone embracing this month.
let's call McCain Senator McWinky. What's up with the Rapid blinking? Is he channeling Palin?
Is Joe the plumber the bald guy in that Ohio video with Obama? Because I thought that was very strong for Obama--even if he didn't convert the guy, Obama sounded like he knew what he was talking about and wasn't afraid to engage.
McCain made a gaffe, my brother pointed it out:
"We need to stop the decline in homeownership."
Oops.
Every time McCain laughs, he snarls. It's not attractive.
Just heard McCain slip in a little nod to Hillary. Still going for her supporters.
Whoa. McCain is going to pull out a hatchet, and THEN a scaple?
That didn't sound too angry or anything...
Spending freeze? *sputter*
I normally consider myself a fiscal conservative, but even before September I thought deficit spending on infrastructure and new energy would be worthwhile. After September, don't we all understand that the federal government is the spender of last resort? Pump money into the economy with decent construction and research jobs--that makes a ton of sense right now. And instead McCain is freezing spending and following in the shoes of Hoover's frugality?
I get that we go with the guy whose policies and style we already like, but it's like McCain has not even an Econ 101 grasp of the issues....No wonder only 90 economists signed their letter from 100 economists.
McCain is going to balance the budget by "getting rid of spending."
Sheffer is giving McCain his opening. Will he take it?
McCain's blaming Obama for the tone because of not doing the Townhalls! Wow.
McCain punked out. He's going passive aggressive, and won't pull out Ayers and say it to his face.
It's all Obama's fault for not doing McCain's townhalls? After last week's townhall that won't fly.
And if McCain went online and read blogs, he'd know he's at 100% negative ads these past couple of weeks.
Does McCain not know the number of negative ads his campaign is running or is he lying.
McCain look like he's about to explode. He's very red.
I love how McCain thinks that saying "I know how to [verb]" is some kind of plan or proposal. I know how to get him. I'll get him. I'll get him no matter what. I know how to balance the budget. I'll do it. He has no plans and he doesn't care about plans. He just wants the job, not the duties or the wonky, boring policy proposals that he would have to make and follow through on.
Really great when you can hear McCain sniff and snort while Obama is speaking. Impressive.
McCain is coming across like a biatch in this exchange. He looks petty and small-minded.
He's lost it all right here.
I'm guess you mean a "woe is me" attitude.
how is ACORN the image of stolen democracy?
ACORN is to democracy what the invasion of Georgia was to the security of the world. Or something.
" "Destroying the fabric of democracy!" Who knew ACORN was a herald of Galactus?!??"
Seriously, the hardest I've laughed all campaign season.
"how is ACORN the image of stolen democracy?"
Because they assist poor people, and help them register to vote, which is like stealing in the eyes of a Republican.
"Well, she's a fucking MAVERICK for starters!!"
Joseph, it shall be the official explanation when they lose. A dumb one, since that would only work if McCain was leading in all the polls and then lost. We'll see how long it lasts.
Wow. He's owning the people at his rallies, every last one of them.
In his heart, McCain will always know that the tone of his campaign was All Obama's Fault for not doing townhalls.
Does the base know McCain favors federal funding for stem cell research?
President Palin would be great for autism. Great. Whoa, Barry jumped on the autism & nailed it to the wall like Jell-O.
Sorry -- I cannot have a lizard as my President.
Someone get McCain a glass of water or something.
I'm afraid this is the worst Obama has sounded in the three debates. He's not doing terrible, but he's lacking a bit of assertiveness. Just doesn't seem as crisp...
Someone please explain to me how nuclear power reduces foreign oil dependence. Very little of oil is used for energy grid power, most of it goes to transportation. Unless John McCain plans on having each of us drive around in a mini nuclear reactor, I don't see how that's going to help.
Maybe I spoke too soon...
Chris, if nuclear's good enough for our brave fighting submarines, it's good enough for your car.
up the workers!
""Destroying the fabric of democracy!" Who knew ACORN was a herald of Galactus?!??"
No one can defeat the power cosmic-wielding might of the Fucking Flaming Acorn!
Scheffer is giving McCain the final word on every single topic. That's some bull.
Second worst segue ever: From free trade agreements to SITTING DOWN AND TALKING WITH DICTATORS!!111!one!
Didn't someone tell him that the You Just Don't Understand stuff was bad for dials?
I think blinking is how controlled rage leaves McCain's body. When it gets too much, we hear his airpipes blowing air forcefully into the microphone. In extreme cases, uncontrolled eyebrow raising allows rage to leave the body. He is unfocussed and struggling to make sentences in his last response. I wish tomorrow was November 4. I've seen enough.
To anyone that has been paying attention, it just doesn't seem like McCain is even thinking anymore. I know that Obama is just a better speaker in many respects, but I just don't see anything but the playbook in McCain.
I think they're getting into the weeds on some these issues, which will go over the heads of some voters. zzzz.
But McCain is getting in some good points. He looks like he's fighting, which is good, but he goes overboard. He looks angry. And he looks smug, again. I don't think smug smells. Does it?
Herald of Galactus... Nice
Great observation about Obama realizing he is on TV. John can not control his facial expressions.
Also, I am seriously going to turn the channel he brings up "Joe Plumber" one more time. Joe Sixpack was bad enough. And why can't he Tyrone Plumber or Raheem Plumber or Jose Plumber....
I never thought I would say it, but the Republicans would be better off having the pitbull with lipstick at this debate because the original maverick has lost his everloving mind. Who is Senator Government?
I;m not seeing it at all. Mccain keeps having this look on his face like he is going to deliver the deadly blow, but instead its an average answer about Joe the Plumber and Senator government. Wow populist conservatist platitudes about government and taxes....
How about Josephine the Plumber?
http://www.tvacres.com/admascots_josephine.htm
Wait a minute... John McCain says no litmus tests, then says "but if you think Roe v. Wade was rightly decided, then that makes you unqualified in my eyes."
That. Does. Not. Grok.
Galactus!!!???
McCain doesn't have that much vision.
What the hell - is there a block on the use of the word cockamamie? Both here and on Megan's blog my comments about McCain using that word are being held up.
And there's something, um, cockamamie about that.
I just got that the title of this post was a Nas reference. Congratulations to me.
Obama should have gone into the reasoning behind the Present votes in the Illinois Senate. His brushback on the partial term abortion grenade was good, but for a lot of people, they didn't pay attention to the Present arguments between him and Clinton. He should have gone over that one more time for people.
"I'm out for dead presidents to represent me... whoooo's woorrrrld is it?"
sorry
Only 15 minutes left for McCain to follow The Corner's advice and work in "I'm erotic."
Which explains why Moe's comment was held up.
Hey all, didn't read every post yet. But Obama has been pretty weak most the day. I think he may be too calm and measured for his own good.
Yeah, I'm out for presidents to represent me, oh yeah!!!!
in reminds me of. With his herky-jerky manner, inappropriate smiles, speech patterns that suggest unfamiliarity with the English language, and odd stuffed-sausage appearance, he is ... Nick from Men In Black! You know, the guy whose body is taken over by a pile of cockroaches until it explodes...
OK, you think I'm crazy, but look again...
The US "spends more per capita" on education says our dear moderator.
The US has more CHILDREN per capita than any of our economic peers.
So it makes sense that we have to spend more to educate our treasures.
Geriatic Max Headroom...i'm sorry I know it's wrong
Sorry, gremlins ate the beginning of my post. But you get my drift.
make that geriatric
McCain thinks Sarah Palin knows a lot about autism because she has an infant with Down Syndrome?
How does that work, exactly?
And here it is, the entire reason for John McCain's candidacy.
He's a McCain, and therefore he deserves it. Otherwise, he'll never live up to his daddy's name.
I'm not seeing McCain as "reaching across the aisle." McCain is petty, arrogant, whiny, angry & entitled.
That whole whiny "I demand an apology for Lewis" tirade was such a turn-off.
"he is ... Nick from Men In Black! You know, the guy whose body is taken over by a pile of cockroaches until it explodes..."
Nah, that comparison works better for Krauthammer. Althought maybe that's a low blow...
Obama shouldn't have mentioned the "P" word. That's the forbidden word for politicians.
When I hear a politician use the word, Promise, it makes my blood run cold.
It looks like McCain was given some coaching on how to act at the end of the debate. His "good job, good job, good job" was loud. And he was focused on shaking Michelle's hand.
Favorite pronunciation mangling of the campaign so far: McCain on Palin. "She's a bresh of freth .. a breath of fresh air." He was that close to a freudian slip.
Obama played defense and won. He lied on his abortion position, plain and simple, but McCain never pinned him down. When Bill Clinton lied, you knew it but you liked him anyway. Obama is much, much better. You don't even want to check his record because you're just sure he's telling the truth.
But it's really disappointing that the one issue that has sunk McCain over all others - the economy, wasn't really discussed. Where were the bailout plan questions?
Not that I think either of these guys have any deep thoughts having spent most of their professional years in government, but it would have been illuminating on what is clearly the most important issue to most voters.
Hey hey =]
Watching fox, and Frank Luntz asked a group of 23 'independents':
How many of you came in here voting for Obama?
(no hands raised)
How many of you thought that Obama won the debate?
(about 16 hands raised)
But they still say that despite that, they still don't trust him and are voting for the McCainiac
He then asked if any of them switched positions..
4 people RELUCTANTLY raised their hands, and one by one he asked them who they went over to, and ALL of them when to Obama.
``````
Props to Ta for this one:
"10:25 Great ending...to the McCain campaign. He's laughing because he doesn't know how much he's bleeding."
What do you mean he lied? Obama's articulated this position many times. What exactly did he lie about, Matt?
Matt writes: "Obama played defense and won. He lied on his abortion position, plain and simple, but McCain never pinned him down."
Bullshit. What was the lie, exactly?
"Not that I think either of these guys have any deep thoughts having spent most of their professional years in government"
How absurd.
McCain can't contain his contempt. He's a petty, small man. A punk.ass.bitch. And demanding an apology from Lewis. G-T-F-O-H
"What exactly did he lie about, Matt?"
He does have a litmus test - why else would he oppose Roberts and Alito. He did vote against the Illinois Born Alive act with the very same protections he said he needed. Wouldn't even let it out of committee.
"How absurd."
Really? What evidence do you have that either of these two have even the slightest clue about derivatives? CMBS risk pricing? The potential for inflation from the bailout? They can't even answer a straight question on what they'd cut to pay for spending.
Or do you think it's absurd that they've spent most of their lives in government service and they probably have little knowledge of the nuts and bolts of business issues?
"He's a petty, small man. A punk.ass.bitch."
And Obama accuses the McCain supporters of slurs. There are a lot of things you can accuse McCain of, but I am certain you wouldn't say that to his face. He is a man's man, whose courage is beyond question.
I've never heard Obama complain about anything McCain's supporters have said on a comments thread. Let's be serious, please.
By the way, it is good to hear Obama does support offshore drilling. He's right, that's a short term answer, but we need relief in the short term. Now if only he would get behind nuclear power his 10 year plan might be achieved.
Silliest line they both agree on? We won't buy oil from this or that country.
False equivalence. "Small man" or "punk ass bitch" isn't gallant, but it's not a slur on par with "is a terrorist who was groomed in a madrassah and who plans to install Islamofascists in government and destroy us all" (which I doubt most of the trolls who spew it would say to his face) and the like because it's unprovable -- an opinion, and thus without concrete meaning.
My point exactly. Message board statements implying that the other guy is a "expletive implying weakness", Muslim jihadists, etc. are silly. And they're particularly silly when applied to a man who has made a decision more courageous than the majority of us can even contemplate. A man who was tortured and then had the courage to tell jokes as he was drug back to his cell. You may not agree with him on policy, but you cannot question his courage.
Matt says: "Or do you think it's absurd that they've spent most of their lives in government service and they probably have little knowledge of the nuts and bolts of business issues?"
Dumbya Bush spent most of his life drunk and in the private sector. How did he do when it came to the economy, chuckles?
Not so well - the 1st "MBA president" pretty much crapped out.
So yes, I think your comment is absurd. Amazingly so.
We can free our dependency on foreign oil, 70% of which we import and some from countries that don't like us.
We'll do it by building nuclear plants, when we import 90% of the uranium and Russia is our biggest supplier.
Huh?
Hey, did you know McCain was a P.O.W.?
Zak reminds:"Hey, did you know McCain was a P.O.W.?"
He's also a former prisoner of war. Plus he was in Vietnam.
You're making a common mistake there, Fred. Nucular power is an entirely homegrown, 100% American-made commodity.
Fred,
very good point. McCain notably did not mention that he would get us off Russian oil, only Middle-eastern and Venezuelan.
In some ways, this is the bigger concern.
How is off-shore drilling a short-term answer? You can build oil rig in a day? And you certainly can't build 45 nuclear power plants in four years.
"Dumbya Bush spent most of his life drunk and in the private sector. How did he do when it came to the economy, chuckles?"
Pretty shitty, mostly because he doubled our national debt. Why, are you a fan of his economic policy?
"Not so well - the 1st "MBA president" pretty much crapped out."
Maybe reading isn't your thing, but I made no comments about his degree. I referred to the fact that two guys who have spent their lifetimes in government likely no little about economic issues affecting businesses, including banks. You've yet to show why this is an absurd position. Chuckles.
As Megan McArdle reminds, the distinction between Middle-eastern and Venezuelan vs. Canadian (or Russian) oil is meaningless. Oil's a globally traded commodity; as long as you're importing any of it, you're at the mercy of the global market.
Hey, in other news, CNN's called the debate for Obama: 58% to 31%.
'He is a man's man, whose courage is beyond question.'
There's a ship or sea for everyone.
Line of the night for (admittedly partisan) me: "Says more about your campaign than it does me."
Barry really is good with the sharp one liners, yeah?
"We'll do it by building nuclear plants, when we import 90% of the uranium and Russia is our biggest supplier."
Got a source for that claim? Why would we buy 90% from Russia when Australia has 24% of the world's supply, and Russia has less than 10%?
http://www.cameco.com/uranium_101/uranium_science/uranium/
Scorupine:
"per capita" means "per person". So if the US spends more "per capita" on education than other industrialized nations, it means we spend more for each student. The number of students is irrelevant.
"very good point. McCain notably did not mention that he would get us off Russian oil, only Middle-eastern and Venezuelan."
If Obama had promised that, please tell us how exactly he would achieve it? Do the barrells have the country of origin on them? Is he going to keep US refiners from buying them if so?
Speaking of other irrelevant things, why do people care what the Presidents think about primary education? Federal funding makes up less than 10% of the funding to your local schools. Beyond basic regulations, why is so much time devoted to this issue? They can do next to nothing, and most school administrators will tell you that what does come out of the DOE is not worth the trouble, regardless of party in charge.
Matt,
You're wrong. I would call him a punk.ass.bitch to his face. After what he's done? I have no qualms whatsoever. He betrayed this country when he put forth that woman as a VP nominee. NOBODY who took THE PRESIDENCY seriously would have put this country in that bind.
I'm sure anyone who posts anonymously on the internet is quite tough. But you're right, she's a horrible choice. Why, she's got as much experience governing as. . . . Barack Obama!
lightmonke:
unless my powers of reasoning fail me, the distinction is significant; "per capita" means per person, not per student. (per capita income, for example, doesn't measure how much people with paying jobs make on average, but the average of what everyone makes.) if the U.S. has proportionately more students than other nations, then spending more per capita does not equal spending more per student. however, i think the actual statistic being referenced here is in fact per student expenditure, not per capita.
Matt:
although I suspect this is a futile exercise, Fred's claims were that the U.S. imports 90% of our uranium, and that Russia is the U.S.'s largest supplier of uranium. neither claim is addressed by your stats.
True, Matt, posting anonymously on the internet doesn't make you tough. But it certainly doesn't mean that you're NOT tough. Stop telling other people what they would or would not say to someone's face. Just because some people don't have the chance to be a POW doesn't mean that everyone is a coward. Stick with your points. You've made some decent ones.
Either way, no matter how mad or how much you care, unless you've got your own 527 ready to spend millions in swing states the next few weeks and unless all the undecideds are actually pro choice and care more about foreign policy and Obama raising taxes and instituting universal healthcare than anything else (in which case your mind is probably already made up), this election goes for Obama.
The Republicans nominated the one guy who had a shot because you can't really tie him to Bush, since even the Repub base doesn't like him because he didn't stay close to Bush. Of course, if your base doesn't like you, that's a problem too.
It's a Democratic year, simply because voters do want change. Obama is long on platitudes, short on specifics, but hey, that's a winning strategy and he should be applauded for recognizing it. He is different in many ways from Bush, and in the ways they are similar (their profilgate spending) those are ways Democrats like.
We're getting an unknown, just like we did 8 years ago. It will be interesting and exciting to see who he really is. Let's hope he doesn't plunge us even further into debt. Or that he's at least willing to curb the most egregious excesses of a Democratic Congress. One party rule is always a little frightening.
Matt,
last comment to you.
John McCain hasn't earned any respect from me. When he sat up there and defended the Klan-like rallies that he and Palin have been holding for the past 2 weeks, as if the pages of history aren't littered with what happens to Black folk when they are alone and come across said crowds,
As a Black person, I'm done.
"Fred's claims were that the U.S. imports 90% of our uranium, and that Russia is the U.S.'s largest supplier of uranium."
Sorry, I thought it would be obvious that the US would not import 90% of its uranium from Russia when it could get it from a close ally who has a lot more - to the extent it's not a world market.
Here, does this satisfy you as to the ludicrousness of his claim?
http://www.fool.com/news/associated-press/2007/12/04/us-oks-some-uranium-imports-from-russia.aspx
Also, note the last sentence in this one:
http://www.forbes.com/afxnewslimited/feeds/afx/2008/02/03/afx4607863.html
Seriously, it's common sense.
"Just because some people don't have the chance to be a POW doesn't mean that everyone is a coward. "
You're right Stacy, which is why I DID NOT SAY THAT.
"As a Black person, I'm done."
As an uninformed person, you were done when you made your claim of "Klan-like rallies". Do at least a little research to back up your nonsense before accusing someone of stirring up racism.
Matt, fair questions:
"If Obama had promised that, please tell us how exactly he would achieve it? Do the barrells have the country of origin on them? Is he going to keep US refiners from buying them if so?"
What matters is not the country of origin but the destination of the dollars. The fact that Russia is in the position to bail out Iceland's debt and post a task force to Venezuela has everything to do with the strength of the global oil market.
We need to cut at the price of oil, and it is tragic that we failed to do so before the Russians bought their military back from the pawn shop. If offshore drilling can reshape the psychology of the oil markets -- as McCain claims -- so too can a serious commitment to wind, solar, and geothermal.
Haven't been stirring up racism. It's been presented to my face, watching those rallies.
I don't worry about Barack Obama, he's got the Secret Service.
I worry about that Black Soundman, who worked for one of the networks, who was called out his name by folks at one of those rallies. I wonder what would have happened to him if he hadn't of been with his colleagues. He could be my brother, cousin, father, nephew, uncle, father or grandfather.
There's little room for interpretation for
KILL HIM
TERRORIST
BOMB OBAMA
Bringing MONKEYS to RALLIES
Maybe in your world, there's room for interpretation. But, as a Black person, who actually knows American history, there's no room for interpretation.
Must...fight...urge to...respond to...troll. I lose:
"Sorry, I thought it would be obvious that the US would not import 90% of its uranium from Russia"
GAH! We import 90% of our uranium. Period. That was the claim. A claim which is, in fact, correct:
http://www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/nuclear/umar/summarytable1.html
Second claim: "Russia is our biggest supplier." I have no idea if this is true. But your second link says that Russia supplies or will soon supply 20% of the U.S. consumption. Common sense? Maybe not.
"9:36 "Destroying the fabric of democracy!" Who knew ACORN was a herald of Galactus?!??"
To agree with an earlier poster - this was the line of the night from all the blogs I have read.
Did you read the first link? Russia has less than 10% of the uranium. And until 2011 we put a crippling tariff on it, and then it is at most 20%. One of our closest allies, Australia, has 24% of all the world's uranium.
And you're wondering if today we import most of it from Russia?
Really? You're right though, you shouldn't respond to people you disagree with if you're not going to use your head.
Of course, none of this has anything to do with the fact that the only way to be energy independent (which I think Obama has now backed off of and is on the whole "not buying from certain countries" nonsense) in 10 years is via some already proven alternative energy sources, of which the most productive today is nuclear power.
Unless he's going to have the government pick winners and losers in the alternative energy scene and massively subsidize one or the other. Which works out for certain producers, but not so great for the country - see also: Ethanol.
10:15 That eloquence attack is a nonstarter. It's a debate. You can't attack someone for being eloquent in a debate.
I just had to submit this as the quote of the night. Coetes killed it in the live blog. I was at a function and missed it, but he made me feel like i saw it.
Coates,
Good job at blogging. You and Sullivan were very good.
Totally off the debate point but the phrase "a man's man" has come to mean something a bit different to me since the time a couple decades back when I wandered into a bar in NYC looking to watch a Bulls playoff game.
When I asked the bartender if they were going to show the game, he said no and suggested a bar down the street as he pointed to a sign which read: "If you're looking for a man's man, you've come to the right bar".
Rikyrah, with Sen. McCain stationed near Vietnam and then as a POW from '67 to '73, I wonder how much he really knows or understands the dynamics of Wallace campaign rallies for President in '64, '68 & '72. To me, if he were in the States at the time, he certainly would have understood Rep. Lewis's cautionary advice.
Matt quotes and writes and quotes and writes: ""Dumbya Bush spent most of his life drunk and in the private sector. How did he do when it came to the economy, chuckles?"
Pretty shitty, mostly because he doubled our national debt. Why, are you a fan of his economic policy?
"Not so well - the 1st "MBA president" pretty much crapped out."
Maybe reading isn't your thing, but I made no comments about his degree. I referred to the fact that two guys who have spent their lifetimes in government likely no little about economic issues affecting businesses, including banks. You've yet to show why this is an absurd position. Chuckles."
It's absurd because Dumbya Bush, who spent MOST OF HIS LIFE OUTSIDE OF GOVERNMENT, knew nothing about economic issues and still doesn't. There's no reason to think private sector experience confers great knowledge in that department, chuckles. And besides, Obama has a much more extensive record outside of government than McCain does. You could even look it up.
Who was your candidate? The hopelessly clueless Mitt Romney? Yikes.
Hey, if private sector experience is so valuable, why are all of these companies reduced to begging for bailouts? Your argument is crap.
Matt writes: "There are a lot of things you can accuse McCain of, but I am certain you wouldn't say that to his face. He is a man's man, whose courage is beyond question."
Well, no, it's not. There were POWs who didn't cave in under questioning. McCain was called "Songbird" by some soldiers at the time.
So it's not like the question can't be raised. And since McCain stood by while Kerry was maligned, fuck McCain.
The sneering and the air quotes at "health of the mother" really got up my dander. WTF was McCain thinking? Even most pro-lifers make exceptions for the health of the mother. Epic-Uber-Ultra FAIL.
Matt's condescension and dripping-with-contempt- for-us-fools tone is suspiciously similar to someone I saw during the debate tonight. Are you channelling Senator McCain, Matt?
I do not want someone that angry making decisions for the country about nuclear strikes and going to war. I do not want someone who is that unable to control, or even fake, his own emotions to be negotiating with Ahmadinejad, Putin et al.
Obama should recycle that 3 am phone call ad Clinton made. Only this time with shots of McCain from the debate looking like he's two seconds away from strangling someone. VO: is this the man you want answering that call?
Cheap shot, I know, but I am genuinely scared that McCain could be the next president. Who was our last really angry president? Nixon was more paranoid and insecure than angry, I think. Clinton at least knew how to control his temper in public (at least he did while he was still president). And say what you want about Bush (and I'm sure we all have a lot to say), but his temper was never something I worry about.
Teddy Roosevelt, a McCain hero, got angry a fair amount. He called people pinheads, fatheads, pithecanthropoid, and so forth. I thought Truman was known for anger, but maybe not. The most angry President was indeed among the worst, Andrew Jackson. As I recall he dueled, nearly bankrupted the nation, and caused the "Trail of Tears" despite Supreme Court opposition. For this he's on the twenty-dollar bill.
Teddy Roosevelt and Jackson did not have nuclear weapon at their disposal.
Someone need to tell Republicans to retire the term "class warfare" when attacking Democrats. What the heck has Sarah Palin been doing for the last month? Real American v/s elites? Come on, if that is not class warfare I'll eat my hat.
McCain said "spreading the wealth" like it's a dirty word or something. Ooh, cooties! Guess what, these days, when you say "spreading the wealth", people's mind don't automatically go to that socialist-commie-pinko-we're-turning-into-Stalin-Soviet place anymore. We just partly nationalized some banks and there haven't been a riot on the streets yet. Shouting "class warfare" and "spreading the wealth" won't win you the election, Senator.
That was a great job moderating. I think Obama had it--not by much, but he had it. I think John McCain just looked petty for much of the debate.
What I took from this debate is the Obama is full of BS and McCain is a big, whiny baby who doesn't know what he's talking about most of the time and can't remember what his opponent said thirty seconds ago.
"Real American v/s elites? Come on, if that is not class warfare I'll eat my hat."
Do you have a hat to eat? "Real America vs elite" is pretty clearly more what's termed "culture warfare" rather than "class warfare." Class warfare refers to pitting economic classes against each other.
Yes, but the populist tone taken by the McCain's campaign clearly suggest the economic class part too, trying to portray the campaign as fighting for the common man etc. Let's face it, there are overlaps between the economic classes and the culture classes.
They are trying to have it both ways, one day supposedly fighting for the common man through the culture aspects, and the next ranting on Obama for "spreading the wealth". In my mind, that is engaging is class warfare.
See, if we'd voted Galactus as the official white-people spokesman back in the poll, we could be down with ACORN, too.
Apparently.
Obama won bigtime.
That was a really terrible performance from McCain. Painfully so. People are afraid to come right out and say he's losing and this election is now Obama's, but there we have it.
Where you been Breuk?
I really must promote Andrew's tape of the debate, especially for those of us who listen without visuals. 538 is right; McCain does do the tongue-thrust thing when he knows he's lying!
ACORN as a herald of Galactus!!!!
Funny, funny stuff!!
*tears rolling*
And yes, 'Joe the Plumber' does remind one of the *waaah, waaaaaah, waaah* soundtracks of the 70's!
I think Joe the Plumber's porn debut should be called "Snaking The Drain." Any other ideas?