How much of your pro-life stance, for you, is informed not just by your Catholic faith but by the fact that you were adopted?
Oh, a lot. Absolutely. I see the power of life in that--I mean, and the power of choice! The thing to keep in mind about it... Uh, you know, I think as a country we get off on these misguided conversations that throw around terms that really misrepresent truth.Explain that.
The choice issue cuts two ways. You can choose life, or you can choose abortion. You know, my mother chose life. So, you know, I think the power of the argument of choice boils down to stating a case for one or the other.Are you saying you think women have the right to choose abortion?
Yeah. I mean, again, I think that's an individual choice.You do?
Yeah. Absolutely.Are you saying you don't want to overturn Roe v. Wade?
I think Roe v. Wade--as a legal matter, Roe v. Wade was a wrongly decided matter.Okay, but if you overturn Roe v. Wade, how do women have the choice you just said they should have?
The states should make that choice. That's what the choice is. The individual choice rests in the states. Let them decide.
I think that about does it. I don't know when, but I can't see Republicans letting this sideshow continue. It's fascinating. I've been reading about Steele for years, but I still have no idea why he's a Republican. I've yet to get any sense of deep conviction from him. Colin Powell, I got. Condie Rice, I got. I even get Clarence Thomas. But what I get from Steele feels almost like a hustle.
The Beautiful Struggle: A Father, Two Sons, and an Unlikely Road to Manhood 
That's the main reason I stay out of arguments about him - tryin not to break his hustle. I just hope he gets replaced with Katon Dawson, so we get to see the segregationalist plotting strategies against the first black prez... hilarious.
I do not know if it is a hustle. I hope he never quits. I want the destruction of both parties. The goal is to have a centrist outlook in both new parties. The extreme wings of both parties can elect a few radical seats to the house.
He's a Black Republican, a quarter century too late. If he had come by in the late 1970's or anytime in the 1980's, he coulda had a chance, he coulda been a contenda.
However, it's clear by now that the (rump) GOP no longer even has much interest in keeping even a couple of tokens around.
OTOH, he's not somebody to have sympathy for.
Yeah, TNC--this does seem like a hustle, but to what end? I read this last night and got that "...and...done." vibe from Steele. On some level, he has to know that the Republican party will not allow him to keep punking them like this; he has to know that giving even the slightest impression that he doesn't hold the party's official views on abortion will get him axed. I mean, could he really be dumb enough to think the Republican party would even entertain the idea that abortion is a viable option for a woman? Maybe he knows the end is coming and he's flipping them the bird--but, of course, he walked the abortion statement back, too. So who knows what's going on in that pointy head of his.
You have company-- Steele apparently has no idea why he's a Republican either. All he has to do now is assert that Obama's a US citizen, and he'll have alienated the entire Republican party.
Michael Steele is a loser.
He was always a loser, with a knack of being at the right place at the right time to grab some sort of high post without having done anything of note to justify him being there.
I do feel a little bit of sadness for black conservatives, who of course will be shut out forever from any leadership post in the racist double-standard loving GOP because of Steele's incompetence, but frankly they should already know they're just window dressing.
Coates
One thing you haven't considered is the mindset of people in the Repubican Party who are going to be leery of firing the guy a couple of months in after promoting him so prominently as their first black chairman. The difference between his reception and Obama's would be pretty striking and you know that his race had something to do with him getting elected in the first place. Plus the guy leading the charge to get him ousted, Katon Dawson, used to belong to a whites only country club until last year. Do you really think even Republicans are dumb enough to replace their first black chairman with a guy with a race problem? I think even they are concerned about that perception problem. Of course the funny thing is they don't realize that a lot of minorities are also think Steele has been an embarrasment. I think he stays until at least after the elections next year when they would have a good reason to fire him. Right now just a few weeks in isn't going to be a good time to can the guy no matter how much of a buffoon he looks.
It isn't as though these guys were loaded for good options when they were choosing. It was the guy from the segregated country club, the guy giving out the CDs with the Barack the Magic Negro track, the guy who was head of the party when they got crushed in the last election, and Ken Blackwell. As an Ohioan, let me tell you this. You ain't seen crazy till youv'e seen Ken Blackwell crazy. Am I forgetting anyone? As embarrasssing as this guy is no one who wants the job is going to be much better. If they don't have a better alternative the replacing Steele after this short a time is just a bad idea, which is why I figure it is exactly what the Republicans will do.
@sgwhiteinfla "Do you really think even Republicans are dumb enough to replace their first black chairman with a guy with a race problem?"
Yes!
You know, Steele's position is that of a lot of conservatives and moderates: Abortion is a tricky issue, and while one may personally believe in that the choice should be the woman's, the decision regarding whether or not to recognize this right should be left to the democratic process in each state. We can disagree about the merits of this position, but it's not clearly unreasonable.
Of course, for the base of the Republican party, this isn't good enough. It's not enough for you to support the overturning of Roe v. Wade, you need to outlaw all abortions.
In short, Steele's dead meat.
Do you really think even Republicans are dumb enough to replace their first black chairman with a guy with a race problem?
sgwhiteinfla:
This interview gave the GOPers who hated his guts just the justification they needed to get rid of him.
That plus the fact that they really are just that stupid and just that racist anyway guarantees Steele will be gone after the special election in New York.
The real problem with all of this is that Michael Steele is so stupid that even when he knows people are gunning for him he gives an interview like this.
Katon Dawson's doing this guy a favor.
I don't think they will get rid of Steele until 2010, when they can blame their staggering election losses on him. The GOP is excellent at creating scapegoats and at the moment, they don't have enough on the guy to scapegoat him. His skin color isn't enough (except for their rabid base) to oust him. They've got to bide their time with Steele so they can continue to ignore their lack of viable policy ideas and blame all of their failures back to Watergate on the black guy. It will be so ugly when they really do turn on him. There will be blood.
Maybe there's something opportunistic about Steele's "conservatism." If her were a black democrat in Maryland, he'd hardly be getting the amount of attention that he's getting as a republican. Really, it just seems like he's a moderate, and could fit into either party as a right of center democrat or a moderate republican.
What cracked me up about this was that it was a dead-serious interview that totally tracked the Daily Show bit with Samantha Bee at the GOP convention, where she tried to get Republicans to use the word "choice" when backing Bristol Palin's decision to go through with her pregnancy.
Bristol's Choice
@Jeff and TNC He's dunzo agreed. The base will not allow the GOP to even compromise on this issue and will not let it move on. Victim of it's own success.
Jeff, like your point about abortion being tricky. I'm deeply suspicious of anyone who is not conflicted by it. There are competing rights at work and honest, moral folk should see the dilemma. It's just intellectually dishonest to claim either side has the complete moral high ground.
I remember watching a show where a Chinese girl was having an abortion not because she was a teenager, but because her baby was a girl. I wonder how many pro-choicer's would march for her choice under those circumstances. It's still her body and her choice.
On the other hand, I'm disgusted by the naked misogyny and hypocrisy of any group who loudly talks of responsibility, violates a woman's body, and then does nothing about the results. That's the essence of irresponsibility.
You know how republicans were saying Obama was/is a Manchurian candidate ready to destroy America through leftist policies, etc? I am now convinced that Steele is really a a democrat who has been feigning conservative tendencies in order to rise to RNC chairman whereupon he sets his meticulous plan afoot:
(1) Fire everyone at the RNC (done)
(2) Don't replace them, crippling the organization (done)
(3) Make buffoonish statements ensuring a reduction in donations (done)
(4) Antagonize the base by starting a fight with Limbaugh (done)
(5) Make even more dumb statements (done) ensuring removal and the loss of black GOP voters for decades (forthcoming).
Steele is a genius.
I should have clarified. I am talking about the Republicans with power. The base never wanted him anyway and would want him gone like yesterday. But even the Republican idiots in Washington know they are stuck with the guy for awhile which is why most of them have refrained from throwing him under the bus. Yesterday Cantor was even lightweight taking up for the guy. Now his pro choice stance is something most people already knew from his past but he couches it in states rights. So they can't really lie about opposing him over abortion because he made many statements in the past on the record on the issue even though its true he changed his tune when running for RNC chair. I kinda want to be wrong though just to see if Steele will bring out the race card in a blatantly hypcritical fashion. But I just don't think it happens until next year unless he has legal issues.
Are you saying you don't want to overturn Roe v. Wade?
I think Roe v. Wade--as a legal matter, Roe v. Wade was a wrongly decided matter.
Okay, but if you overturn Roe v. Wade, how do women have the choice you just said they should have?
The states should make that choice. That's what the choice is. The individual choice rests in the states. Let them decide.
I don't think someone expressing these views would get the Democratic Party Presidential nomination. What he described above, overturning Roe and States rights are decidedly conservative. The only thing that isn't is that he is for a woman being able to choose.
I agree with that.
I've been on the "oh man this is gonna be good!" Steele train from the beginning. I figured Steele would:
1) Make a decent first impression (he is an affable man)
2) Start stepping in it (he's a bad manager and just not that smart)
3) Freak out the GOP moneymen who would step in and tell him to zip it while they run things behind the scenes.
I did think it would take more than 30 days to hit stage 3. But I think we're there now. I think the GOP will keep Steele but he'll dial back his public appearances. The RNC will hire some deputy to actually run things, and Steele will spend his work days like Arthur Carlson in WKRP in Cincinnati: shut in his office playing with remote-control cars while listening to P Diddy and the Pack Rats.
Colin Powell, I got. Condie Rice, I got. I even get Clarence Thomas. But what I get from Steele feels almost like a hustle.
A commenter at Wonkette proposed that Steele is a cylon hybrid sleeper agent created by Rahm Emannuel, for laughs. (@patagonia: Great minds think alike.)
Do you really think even Republicans are dumb enough to replace their first black chairman with a guy with a race problem?
For months now, every time I've said "not even Republicans would be dumb enough to...." I've been proven wrong. (And I'm an independent; I've voted for Republicans. But on a national level just now they're an unfunny joke.) I believe Dawson, despite the requisite funny name, claims to have been politicized when his high school was integrated, so the optics are terrible.
But maybe it will be like that guy who funded the Gray Davis recall in CA, and then once he'd done all that work, Ahnold appeared. Rs will let Dawson take down Steele, but at the price (to Dawson) of needing to take himself out, and (to the party) of answering the "could the RNC get more ridiculous?" question in the affirmative.
If they don't have a better alternative the replacing Steele after this short a time is just a bad idea, which is why I figure it is exactly what the Republicans will do.
Like going down into the basement in a horror movie.
@hubcap:
This post is to inform you that you have violated my method patent for "A method of responding to a thread in the Atlantic blog section in which the content is an opening statement followed by a numbered list followed by some more content."
Please forward the sum of $10,000 via paypal to TNC for escrow or else you and I will have a date in the eastern district of Texas later this year.
Good day!
If the republicans are smart, they're not going to push this too hard. Steele's remarks are pretty consistent with the opinions of a lot of people who consider themselves pro-life, because they've don't really understand what pro-choice means. If they kick him out for saying something that a lot of conservatives think is perfectly reasonable, it's not going to help the party's future success.
Hopefully, they'll kick him out. I do feel bad for the guy, though.
@hubcap
Thanks for the WKRP reference. That's why I love this blog. Folks at other blogs wouldn't have spit water on their computer after reading that. They would have said, "Who? Is that station on the internet?"
Aw, sh—. It’s on my, uh, computer there. I haven’t pulled it up yet, but I’ll get a little bit goin’ in a second or two.
"Please forward the sum of $10,000 via paypal to TNC for escrow or else you and I will have a date in the eastern district of Texas later this year."
I REALLY like the idea of TNC holding money in escrow while commenter's bets are decided. This seems like a great idea. Illegal, but great.
I'll take the Rams to win the Super Bowl at a 100-1. Does anyone want that action?
If tnc "gets" Clarence Thomas, he's literally the only person who does.
Michael Steele is hard to understand. He is essentially a moderate Republican which is what the Republicans need to get any cred back with the general public. Don't think its a hustle, I do think in the long run he's good for the GOP, however, they'll wind up cutting their nose off to spite their face, AGAIN.
So, doing research on stem cells is being like a Nazi doctor, but abortion is a woman's choice? This guy is for real?
I just don't believe it.
As for Katon Dawson, according to this article, "Republican party strategists in attendance at the meeting openly fretted about the possibility of electing Dawson, who had acknowledged his membership in a whites-only club, and the signal it would send to a country that had just elected Barack Obama as the nation's first black president."
What this suggests is that the Republican Party is not monolithic. There are many who realize how stupid an idea it would be to promote someone like Dawson now, but a certain number of them are every bit as clueless as we suspect.
P.S. For the record, I think Roe v. Wade was wrongly decided. And I consider myself pro-choice.
While the interviewer took it as a joke, I think there's a lot of truth to this. Steele is, as has been pointed out, very moderate/centrist politically, and could probably be welcomed in either party. Why is he a Republican? Because his mama didn't want to raise her children with government money.
Also, he's clearly very ambitious and seemingly has more career opportunities as a moderate African American in the Republican party than in the Democratic party.
DougEMI
To cover his ass today Steele said that he is for a federal ban on abortion. Is that also conservative in your book because it seems to contradict his earlier statement about state's rights? Of course thats the kind of double speak you get from leading "conservatives" nowadays.
http://thinkprogress.org/2009/03/12/steele-pro-life/
Definitely. Especially in Maryland, where there are plenty of smart, ambitious African-American Democrats.
Say, what's the opposite of "political ju-jitsu?" (a sad, tired phrase, btw). Something that means trying to wrongfoot your opponent, but somehow pinning yourself instead. Because whatever it is, the GOP has it down.
"Women liked Hillary Clinton...how to respond...I know...Sarah Palin!"
"America elected a black President...how to respond...I know..Michael Steele!"
I guess EPIC FAIL will do.
Roe was not a good decision, because states all around the country, from Alaska to Montana to North Carolina, as well as California and New York, were legalizing abortion all on their own. It wasn't seen as a religious issue, as the President of the Southern Baptists at the time said he had no problem with abortion, and it wasn't seen as a partisan issue as conservatives like Reagan supported it, while plenty of Democrats like Scoop Jackson opposed it (though Scoop was no liberal). It was Roe that turned it into a thing, and the religious right used it as part of their backlash against the liberal elites.
What's more, this is not a conservative view, it's the one held by Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg as well as myself. Not to mention it wasn't a very good decision from a legal point of view: I like the two trimester guideline, but it's just not in the Constitution.
As for Steele, I am not sure even he knows what he's talking about when it comes to basic political issues.
Add me to the list of people who would like to see the back of Roe. The reasoning is bad, and it has a corrosive approach on party politics. There's way too much emphasis on who will get to appoint the next few Supreme Court justices. That kind of Kremlinology is unsuited for a system where major policy initiatives are supposed to come out of the legislature and include inputs from a variety of sources.
I hate abortion. I think it's always a bad thing. But sometimes it might be the least bad option. Not as often as current abortion rates would indicate, though. We need to do a lot more to reduce the need. I kind of think I'm near the political center of gravity on the issue. Permit abortion early in pregnancy, but do everything you can to make it unnecessary.
You can't have the discussion you need to get you there if abortion is enshrined as a right, though.
Steele's position in the intial post here doesn't strike me as absurd. If he backtracked afterwards, though, then he's not doing enough to manage wingnut expectations.
TNC, don't call Michael Steele a "hustle." That term would imply that he's actually competent at something (i.e. "hustling").
This might inspire him (Steele) to a new approach to hip-hop-ifying the GOP...going on tour with Rick Ross and turning "Hustlin'" into the antem for the RNC!!
"everyday i'm hustlin'...everyday i'm hustlin'!"
Don't mean to thread jack, but personally, I wish the left would not get so caught up in what appears to be minor and mediocre players on the right. I find the soap opera on the right to be somewhat bo-ring. Now maybe I am underestimating Steele, the way Howard Dean was underestimated, but I don't think so. The Republican party and its enablers strike me as a dithering bunch.
Now, on the other hand Obama's recent hire of Van Jones strikes me as a rather interesting occurance. I like how he connects environmental issues with people issues. I've been waiting for decades for a voice like that myself. Perhaps some here know more about him. He's a west coast guy, so I like that too.
But at any rate, I am hoping that Van Jones becomes an African American "politician" that has more to offer us than Michael Steele will ever dream of having: http://vanjones.net/page.php?pageid=2.
I'm really trying to understand why he said what he did, because Steele is personally VERY anti-choice.
All I can surmise is that he forgot his audience for a moment: During his Senate run he tried to shade just how anti-choice he was. But he's RNC Chair, now--not a Maryland Senate candidate.
I didn't expect him to last long, but this is ridiculous.
I don't quite understand what his position is, but it sounds like he... personally wouldn't vote for an abortion ban in his own state, but he believes that Roe was wrong and that states should be allowed to ban it if they like. Which I guess is about my position. Anyway, I don't know that's a disqualifier.
"I think that about does it. I don't know when, but I can't see Republicans letting this sideshow continue. It's fascinating. I've been reading about Steele for years, but I still have no idea why he's a Republican. I've yet to get any sense of deep conviction from him. Colin Powell, I got."
A couple of thoughts:
First, what Steele said above isn't as incoherent as you seem to think. What he seems to be trying to say is largely true about Roe v. Wade: the legal basis for it was specious*, it made the abortion issue unnecessarily contentious, and abortion would still be legal in most of the country even if Roe v. Wade were overturned (in that case, abortion laws would be made by the states, and in states like New York -- where abortion was made legal years before Roe v. Wade -- it would continue to be legal).
Second, I'm not sure what you "get" about Colin Powell -- the man's political leanings are those of a Rockefeller Republican if anything, which is to say he'd be pretty comfortable in the Democratic Party (and he seemed pretty comfortable endorsing Barack Obama). As for why Steele is a Republican, I suspect it is partly for career advancement, as I suspect it was partly for Powell (in Powell's case, gratitude may have been part of the equation as well, as it was a Republican President, Reagan, who accelerated his career). Since there aren't a lot of black Republicans, there are more career opportunities as a political appointee for a black Republican, especially when the party wants to appear more inclusive. Democrats, sporting the country's first black President, don't have as much need for this sort of symbolism, and in any case, if Steele were a Democrat he wouldn't be in the top tier of black political talent. Dems have a deeper bench of talented black politicians.
*The legal basis -- a "right to privacy" -- is specious because if that right were consistently upheld it would also be unconstitutional for law to proscribe drug use, suicide, etc.
Say, what's the opposite of "political ju-jitsu?" (a sad, tired phrase, btw). Something that means trying to wrongfoot your opponent, but somehow pinning yourself instead. Because whatever it is, the GOP has it down. --hubcap
We really do need a new vocabulary term here, something between "outsmarting yourself" and "Epic Fail." The latter is a little too general and grandiose.
The sense is captured in "That word you keep using, I do not think it means what you think it means." That sentiment, but shorter.
TNC - Way to have this post cited by the NY Times:
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/03/12/steele-under-fire/?hp
Congrats!
Now maybe I am underestimating Steele, the way Howard Dean was underestimated, but I don't think so.
I've had similar thoughts. Steele and Dean have one thing in common: a knack for saying unbelievably stupid things. But Dean has two qualities that Steele utterly lacks: vision and cojones.
Oh, TNC, I forgot to add: Michael Steele is ALL about the hustle. Thought you knew. When it comes to him, this is the quote I use to the uninitiated:
"I don't knock Steele's hustle--and it *is* a hustle."
Steele has no real convictions (though I believe he holds a few very right-wing positions) and loves the high life (saw him on a first class trip to Paris a couple of years ago...thought repubs didn't do anything French--heh)--how could he be anything *but* a Republican?
This just again highlights the extremism of the Republican party. This is, sadly, the most reasonable I've heard Steele sound, and I think it's a pretty moderate position for a lot of people. Alas, the GOP is so far gone that being reasonable and moderate will put your head directly on the chopping block.
Think about if this view on abortion were the standard Republican view? They'd actually be competing with the Democrats for some independent, centrist voters. Why can't they see that squelching this is total suicide? At what point do they cut the far right off so they can start their own crazy party? Say what you want about Democrats (and I have) but at least their whack jobs know their place.
Tonight we're at the finals in the RNC Gynmastics Competition. We're watching Michael Steele of Maryland, representing the hiphoppers. He'll be attempting a Reverse MittRomney, with a 3.8 degree of difficulty. Let's watch...
Oh no! Steele flopped when he should have flipped, he's down on the mat with his head stuck us his ass.
Next up, Mike Huckabee, representing the AmTalibangelicals. Oops, he just pulled himself out of the competition, says he "needs to spend more time with his family". Either that or he just signed a $50b contract with FauxNews...
I have to admit, of all the issues I thought Steele would get in trouble for, abortion wasn't one of them. Abortion, and his stance during the Senatorial election, was one of the reasons given that he lost the election. This was a shock to me, because all the rest of his public statements on abortion have been pretty solid GOP.
@hub @Deborah: Hoist by your own petard might do the trick.
You can't make this stuff up. You just can't. And as per the norm, he walks it back within 24 hours.
And his last name is Steele. Oh, the irony.
Like I said, you can't make this stuff up.
And his last name is Steele. Oh, the irony.
And he's 6'4". And his sister was once married to Mike Tyson. DEFINITELY ironic.
Word! Mr. Steele is a ground hustler.
They are getting huffy with him because the dude
knows why he was picked--to tarnished and rubbished Barack. He gets it and he is fully prepared not to fulfill such lucre-minded game plan. Remember what they did to brother JC Watts. This is the movie: "Two can play the game". He wants to get the last dime of his speech and slogan (Drill,baby Drill) at last year convention. If he was working as a message consultant for Pepsi or so, that slogan would have worth over $5 million. So let the brother have every dime of his labor.
Problem is, Steele as a moderate Republican is walking on the tightrope without a wire. He needs some clever moderate Republican think tank to give him direction and ideas, but there ain't no such thing any more. Shame, really.
Say, what's the opposite of "political ju-jitsu?" (a sad, tired phrase, btw). Something that means trying to wrongfoot your opponent, but somehow pinning yourself instead. Because whatever it is, the GOP has it down. --hubcap
Vulgarity alert-
My husband likes to say "a lot can happen when you bite your own balls..."
(It's the punchline of a long joke about a wrestler interviewed after losing a match to an invincible champion, who gets him all tied up in a spot where he thinks he can bite his opponent's balls... oops.)