But come on. Who isn't into this flick for the beatdown? Trust. You won't be disappointed (unless you're looking for an abundance of punny smack-talk). Just turn off your brain, embrace the derivativeness, and close your ears to the Beyonce power ballad playing over the credits. ("I wanna run smash into you," Beyonce? Really?)On one level this is just flicks like Trois, going mainstream--Obsessed carried the weekend. But I've stayed away from this, mostly because I feel the film is feeding on a hostility toward white women.
I'm haunted by an old memory: Back in college I went to see Waiting To Exhale. The theater was overrun with black women, which was cool with me. I actually like seeing films in the hood, given that there's often something participatory, if ignorant about it--Only negroes bring their two-year old to see The Two Towers.
Anyway, the thing that got me was the scene where Anglea Bassett barges in the boardroom and slaps the shit out of the white woman her husband has been sleeping with. The whole theater lost it--I'm talking damn near a standing ovation. Word is that this scene was repeated around the country. Now maybe Negroes just liked Bassett's bop. Maybe they just were happy to see the "other woman" get hers. Maybe everyone just wanted to stand at the same time. But I don't think so. I think race was essential to that scene and the crowd's reaction.
I could have this wrong, but I think pitting a blonde homewrecker against and upwardly couple played by Elba and Beyonce is speaking in crude code to black women. Or maybe not. Maybe I'm stuck on race. Maybe I just need to see the movie. Kenyatta saw the flick at Court Street in Brooklyn, a theater which I love almost as much as the one up here on 125th. She said fools lost it on the fight scene. Anyway here's the trailer, for those who don't know.
The Beautiful Struggle: A Father, Two Sons, and an Unlikely Road to Manhood 
I think people are trying to make something out of nothing. I don't get the "race-vibe" from this movie. If there's a message behind the premise then it has escaped me.
Of course, I didn't get the vibe either when I watched Waiting To Exhale. Yeah I laughed when Angela slapped the taste out of the other woman's mouth. But it was more of a "the home wrecker is getting what she deserves" laugh and not a "this is for my people" chuckle.
No vibe at all, really? I'm your standard-issue small-town white guy and when I saw the commercial for this movie for the first time I couldn't help but think "formula pic." That formula being "The Evil Blonde Has Come to Poach." Forumal films that appeal to a target audiences biases have always existed and likely always will. It's a quick and easy way to make a buck.
The filmmakers for Obsessed have stated many times that the film is a remake of that widely successful 80's film, Fatal Attraction -- starring Michael Douglass and Glenn Close, two white actors. So, yes, it is indeed a formula pic, as you say
I agree with you Bougie....my gf's and I all howled in glee when Angela slapped the other women in Waiting to Exhale. Our reaction (discussed ad nauseum later by us) was due to the man-stealer getting her due and had nothing at all to do with said man-stealer's race. We would have howled just as loudly had Angela bitch-slapped a man-stealing sista.
I haven't seen Obsessed so can speak very little on it. But I have heard that a lot of the excitement surrounding it, is based on seeing the very lovely Beyonce engaged in hand-to-hand combat with another lovely woman -- who justly deserve an ass-whipping for trying to take B's man and not just because she's a white woman. This female-to-female combat appeals to the male viewer (the explicit eroticism of seeing two attractive women brawling) and the female viewer (the thrill of witnessing the punishment of the other woman). This, IMO, is one of the reasons -- aside from B.'s popularity -- that the film did see well in its first weekend at the box office.
Yes, it was just glee from Angela go after the man-stealer. The man-stealer could have been played by Lil Kim for all I care, I would have still laughed. Not to say it's right, but there have been a many a times where a woman would love to just "shake somebody" for their infamous man-stealing tendencies. It was oh-so-lovely to see it played out on the bigscreen. Without a doubt the popularity of the movie was based on B's popularity and the throw-in incentive of a chick fight for the men. *yawn*. It will be interesting to see if it holds the top rank for another week.
I just watched the movie with one of my girlfriends. We went to the to the movie for two reasons: Idris and Beyonce. I have to admit-yes-we even talked to the screen...his fineness and her beatdown of Ali Larter.
However, I need to say that absolutely this movie deals with race and again movies are symbolic. Black women who often work in jobs with a high number of white females who participate and benefit from white privilege and are often silenced in a variety of ways. And I think when we go to the movies I think that we yell at the "symbol" of white women for a variety of reasons not simply the you stole my man logic.
Give us a little credit.
Since Spike Lee already made this move you'd think they'd at least go for a little variety and make Beyonce the other woman.
I agree. The black man, blond women lost its edginess about a thousand pornos ago. They should have made String leave Beyonce for Puff Daddy or Richard Gere. Now that would have gotten my attention. Or maybe have Beyonce cheat on String with Jeffrey Goldberg. They could have called it: "If I was a Goy!"
On the other hand, I'm glad to see Elba in a mainstream, blockbuster movie. For those who haven't seen it, he was great in "Sometimes in April", an HBO film about the Rwandan genocide that I thought was loads better than Hotel Rwanda.
Instead of Ali Larter, they should have just had a Wire fan obsessed with Stringer Bell trying to break up their relationship. I could have starred.
haha! That is great. File Stringer Bell next to 2Pac. And Elvis.
I love Stringer Bell. And he was great on The Office
Sorry for being off topic, but please TNC comment on this weak sauce from Byron York:
http://yglesias.thinkprogress.org/archives/2009/04/york-obama-is-actually-not-so-popular-because-some-people-who-like-him-are-black.php#comments
I love it when TNC lays the smack down.
I wrote up a post, and decided not to publish it. It's funny. But it's stupid. We know what this is. I can't keep saying the same thing...
Now, no more threadjacking.
If you are wrong, TN, then so am I, because I had the same reaction when I saw the trailer on tv. They certainly played up the "beat down the white slut for trying to take your man" angle.
I thought that the movie looked like a shitty Basic Instinct (which is saying something), made shittier by its PG-13 rating.
Idris Elba looks better with glasses. One of the very few.
Long-time lurker (I'm talking about since back to your days at the Village Voice when I stayed checking weekly for you and Greg Tate.)
Hostility toward white women in movies?!?! I definitely can't recall ever picking up on that trend. Sometimes some movies will provoke racial animosity. Sometimes on purpose, sometimes accidentally. Sometimes it's just amusing to see someone slap the sh*t out of someone else onscreen. Now, when Sidney Poitier gives Larry Gates that smack for being out of pocket in "Heat of the Night" it sent chills. But context and time was key. Maybe some people loved the fight scene in "Obsessed" because of Beyonce-directed schadenfreude.
I think Beyonce is the beat downer, not the beat downee, in this flick.
I didn't see this movie as anything other than a bootleg "Fatal Attraction" until my husband (got married two weeks ago!) had a reaction similar to TNC's. But one of the more interesting things he said was, "Why doesn't this dude just confess to his wife and be done with this crazy broad? Why are successful black men always portrayed as dishonest and incomplete without a white woman?" My blonde, blue-eyed husband continues to surprise me.
I have no interest in seeing this movie. Its' ilk shows up ad naseum on LifetimeTV, only different flavors of obsession. And of course, there's the racial dog-whistle - designed to get black women into the theaters, some dragging their men with them.
The story of the "Black man stealing Blonde" has special currency in these times. Look at all of the crazed coverage Michelle Obama gets for being a "brown-skinned" woman who has managed to land and keep her man. This seems to fly in the face of the mythology of successful Black men (professionals, athletes, actors) always choosing White women (or anyone but a black woman) as the beneficiaries of their success.
Cant speak on Obsessed, but ditto on Court St.
Caught Monsters vs Aliens there last night, its a fine theater.
I still prefer Magic Uptown but Court St will do for Planet Brooklyn.
Oh! I also immediately thought Trois when I saw the trailer. Its like they sought out the same sad-sack cinematographer. Why the heck is the movie so poorly lit, anyway? A creative decision?
I had a similar reaction...and i also picked up on the white-blonde angle too...why not a white brunette? to far-fetched? Why are brown men pictured asweak-minded, and why are blonde girls always sluts?
Not trying to argue any 'reverse-sexism' here, but aren't ALL men typically pictured as weak-minded in popular movies and television? Generally speaking, of course...
yeah, sexism does go both ways. Obviously it's impact tends to negatively affect women more often, but men get forced into gender roles too. And Bruce, dude, the movies a remake of Fatal Attraction, where the male character is white. I don't disagree too much with that point in general though
Although it's a pretty constraining sexism: the guy's dumb, dishonest, and cheats on her.... but she can't leave him, and she can't realize that he is probably himself the blonde's girl's just desserts.
The idea that this flick doesn't have the racial subtext, that it's just about adultery and the other woman, is disingenuous. Although props to the PR team for trying -- in an interview with Idris Elba he said the movie was for those people not old enough to remember Fatal Attraction.
Seriously? I mean, sure, the young'uns may not have been front row center in 1987, but for pete's sake, the film is on CONSTANT basic cable rotation. It's part of the American psyche. Black or white, Boomer or Gen X or Gen Y -- if I say to you about a woman, "lock up your pet bunnies, folks" you're telling me y'all are gonna scratch your heads and wonder what I mean? For real?
Fatal Attraction is sui generis. It doesn't need to be remade, and is most likely going to be a flop -- unless you're going to juice the formula to get people into the seats. Let's see, what can we do to make the Other Woman even worse? Oh, I know -- she's not just a crazy bitch, she's a crazy honky bitch!
But hey, if folks really want to see a white woman getting the shit beaten out of her for getting freaky with a black woman's husband? Here's the link, the loveliness starts at 2:00 into the clip:
Spike Lee, As Usual, Did It Better
wow, good scenes. spike lee is a genius. a racist (not on display here) but a genius. (hint, look at any south asian/arab (whatever right they're all the same) character in any spike lee movie for some pure blackface slapstick comic relief reminiscent of the worst bullying... but i REALLY digress)
he's a genius. the music played during the scene with her father and then briefly her girlfriends moving her out, and in the next one with the guys in the store with john turturro, is so well-chosen. great camera work too.
Zacksback,
I agree with you about the disingenuousness of the movie's promoters. However, while I would have no problem recognizing a reference to Fatal Attraction (I was 17 when the movie came out), I am not sure that a person under the age of 25 would recognize it so readily. Making a direct pop-culture reference to a movie, tv show, or song that came out before the Clinton administration is a risky thing to do when your listeners are barely of drinking age. (If a young person does recognize such a reference, it is because it was featured in a episode of The Simpsons of The Family Guy.)
so why do black women hate white women so much?
I don't personally hate white women, but I'm just going to keep my mouth shut on why others might.
it just strikes me that you wouldn't ever see the reverse play out: a white woman slapping the taste out of a black woman's mouth, and then all the white women in the theatre standing up and cheering...
and would the black women react the same way if there were two black women in a catfight like that?
just curious as i am neither black nor a woman so i have little experience with these matters...
It's a good question. More than a bit over-generalized by TNC standards, but I have seen black women exhibit some very open and unnecessary animosity toward white women over the years and I'd like to hear someone take an honest crack at answering. Otherwise I'll have to accept my mother's reasoning as to why the black girls pulled her hair and beat on her in school. She said they were jealous of her long straight hair.
freaktown, do white people -- men or women -- ever really get verbally expressive at the movies? This is a serious question; I am not trying to be funny. In my experience, white viewing audiences are very sedate and mild-mannered when watching movies.
As TNC mentioned, some of the fun of watching a movie with a majority black audience is just how engaged and animated the audience can be while watching the film -- they will, oftentimes, shout, laugh loudly, make comical comments, and talk back at the screen. (Ok, sometimes this can get out of hand and be disruptive to the rest of the audience. But, in general, it can be a fun, communal viewing experience.)
So, to your point, would white women -- even if they felt the excitement -- ever stand up and cheer during a scene in a movie theater? I've never seen it happen.
"More than a bit over-generalized by TNC standards, but I have seen black women exhibit some very open and unnecessary animosity toward white women over the years and I'd like to hear someone take an honest crack at answering."
Laborlibert,
What was the context in which this animosity expressed? Was it a case of Black women expressing disdain towards a White woman for dating or even marrying a Black man, particulary a Black man who was a celebrity? Was it a case of Black women expressing disdain for white female coworkers, particularly ones who were promoted to supervisory positions over Black female employees? Details, please.
"why do black women hate white women so much?"
The question I think you're asking is: Why do black women hate seeing white women with black men? Having realized the hypocrisy and racism of reacting to a black male/white female couple (eyes rolling stare at the black male in question), I've had to answer the question for myself and attest for my own rage.
Simply put: I have a higher preference for dating black men (and I suspect it's the same for many other black women). I was raised in a family with interracial heritage and I'm not talking about the "we are all mixed" kind. My mother always encouraged me to date good men--not just good black men. By all accounts I should have grown up feeling free to date all types of men. Also, I think, seeing a black man (one who I'd be interested in dating...of course) with a white woman translates to some that he is buying into the idea of "white beauty."
I haven't seen the movie. I refused believing from the poster that it was going to be a hot ass mess. It wasn't the racism towards white women, which I embarrassingly did not realize, but it's portrayal of the "big bad black woman" out to protect her black man. And I do not agree with another commentator regarding the "Waiting to Exhale" scene. For every black woman who clapped because she was sticken' it to the "other woman," there were probably more who inside felt better that she was sticken' it to the "other white women."
Sigh.
Obviously we are going there.
From those black women that I know who dislike white women it is usually because they are with a black man. I've never really understood the anger towards the white woman as if anything it should be towards the black man.
For instance, when Wesley Snipes gave an interview to Ebony a few years back he went off on how black women basically won't get up and make him a sandwich at 2am but white women would so he chose to date only non-black women. Negro please.I have no problem with the white women but I do have a problem with Wesley Snipes and black men who think that way about sistas.
This needs to stop. Nothing good can come from a question like "Why do black women hate white women so much." It's borderline trolling. Do it again, and you'll be banned. Commenters have responsibilities too.
I'm trying to respond to eltoro so I hope this ends up in the right place. I've seen animosity in the workplace surely, but never related to the promotion scenario that you imagine. usually its just random and unsupported insults about a white woman's weakness, prissiness or subjugation to the men of the workplace.
Otherwise, the animosity I've encountered has occurred in everyday life on the streets of this great City. It generally involves the black woman responding to some percieved slight or insult ont he part of the white woman, like the white woman not sitting next to the black woman on the subway or not moving out of the way or making a fuss about what she's eating at a restaurant or not controlling her kids up to standards at a Department store. I realize these are all sort of silly examples from every-day life, but they are genuine observations.
I wrote my comment before TNC's regulation and won't go any further on freaktown's question. I'll note that I don't think its trolling because black/white women animosity was a significant point made in his original post.
Right. But he didn't ask for thoughts on "black/white woman animosity." He asked "so why do black women hate white women so much?" That isn't the same.
More to the point, there are hundreds of places where you can have this debate in exactly those generalized terms. This is just one modest place where I don't care to see it. If you consider that an inconvenience, than you should probably take this opportunity to read some other blogs that debate race. There's a home out there for this sort of thing. It just isn't here.
Thanks TNC, because that came from waaaay out of left field.
I don't hate white women. Some of my best friends are white. lol. Okay moving on...
I ain't going to another blog to talk about this. People are effing nuts out there. I can't think of another place where I could discuss black/white female racial animosity without an army of batshit crazy people dominating the argument. If you don't want to host the discussion, hey it's your house. No reason to act all huffy about it.
Hah. Hilarious as always.
Did any of you see the movie? The Idris Elba character doesn't actually cheat on Beyonce. Ali Larter is a crazy woman who believes she is in a relationship with Elba because she's nuts. Beyonce rather unfairly suspects Elba of cheating and lying, but comes to believe him when Larter briefly kidnaps their baby.
Frankly, it would have been better if Elba had cheated with Larter. As it was, it was kind of morally simplistic--two good people versus one evil (but crazy) person. It would have been better also if the Larter character had been better at playing mind games with Elba, so that no matter what, he couldn't get people to believe she was doing all this crazy stuff.
Fundamentally, this movie was just not freaky enough. I thought it compared pretty poorly with Lakeview Terrace, where the twisty messed-up parts of Samuel Jackson's psyche were combined with a cleverness and an ability to deflect suspicion from himself because of his status as a cop.
If that's the plot-that there's no actual relationship between Elba and Larter-I'd say that makes it more interesting. My assumption was it was more of this tedious Scorned Woman bs that always lets the guy off the hook.
It would have been better also if Larter could act her way out of a paper bag, but that's neither here nor there. (Although perhaps a whole nother post-racial meaning to "brown paper bag" test!).
I was actually happy to see that he didn't cheat. It gave the movie a different spin. Everyone was ready to see the brotha fall for some tail. Now I didn't say white tail, blonde tail, or brown tail - just tail in general. By having him remain faithful to his wife it placed a better spin on it and didn't have us walking out afterward saying "You know brothas can't resist hot tail to save their life."
And hence, a whole new thread/debate would have been born.
I see where you are coming from, but this made the movie more boring. To me, a good thriller has moral ambiguity--the good guys aren't 100% good and the bad guys aren't 100% bad. Otherwise, you just have formulaic children's entertainment. That's why film noir still fascinates 50 and 60 years later, and why we love movies like The Godfather.
Obsession was, in the end, bad noir. I mean, compare Elba's character here to Stringer Bell, an ambiguous character if there ever was one--a gangster trying to seamlessly get out of the gangster life; a murderer who creates a coop to reduce the number of murders (not for any moral qualms, just that murders are bad for business); a drug dealer who also conforms to our national feel-good myth of the guy who makes up for his lack of education and opportunity growing up by going to night school and getting a degree. We loved him and felt bad for loving him. Now to say that Obsession wasn't as good as The Wire is unfair, but the difference between the two characters exemplifies the qualities that separate interesting narrative art from uninteresting narrative art, as far as I am concerned.
I mean Obsessed, not Obsession. Sorry.
Wasn't there a movie a few months ago where an interacial couple(white man, black woman) move in next to Samuel L. Jackson, and he proceeds to ruin their lives? Was this a dream I had? From the previews, it seemed like a similar type of movie...
lakeview terrace??
Yes, Lakeview Terrace. Nobody plays a badass or a pyscho like Sam Jackson. And to the point of Coates' post, I was a bit divided on whether there was a subliminal thing going on or not. Jackson's character had recently lost his wife. And then in moves this interracial newly wed couple next door. I was torn between "Jackson is emotionally jacked up and twisting his grief to terrorize these people" and "so black men don't like it when white men date sistahs?"
Yah but... we've discussed on this blog before how all people, white or black, have had run-ins with asshole cops. (White folks not to the horrible extent black folks have, of course). But I do think there's a common fear that if a cop (of whatever race) decides he's going to harass you, there's not a damn thing you can do about it. You're powerless.
So I think that if you took a poll, many more people would answer "yes" to the question "ever been harassed by a cop?" than answer "yes" to the question "ever had a psycho bitch invade your marriage?" In that sense, Lakeview Terrace is more universal than Obsesses or Fatal Attraction.
Actually, one reason Lakeview Terrace and Obsessed may seem so similar is that they share a screenwriter, David Loughery.
It wasn't a very good film. I reviewed it over on Pajiba, but the sum up is just that it is the thirtieth remake of Fatal Attraction without the balls to go someplace different or really dark.
An interesting aside is that the audience in the theater where I saw it was about 3/4 composed of middle aged black women. The theater was more or less silent for the entire film, until the Beyonce/Ali Larter fight at the end at which point the theater suddenly became game 7 of the World Series. I do not dare to make any generalizations based on this experience.
Bringing small children to inappropriate movies definitely crosses racial lines. Also the part where, during the scary scenes, the sinning parent keeps saying to the sobbing, terrified toddler "No, honey, it's just pretend--see? It's just in fun. Shhhhhhh. See? It's not really scary...Shhhhhh. No...stop crying!"
I haven't seen any of the movies in question, but I had to comment on the psycho parents at movies subpoint.
Bringing small children to inappropriate movies definitely crosses racial lines.
I'm with you on that. It freaked me out to see parents (white) with a couple of little kids at Underworld: Evolution. A five year old doesn't need to see a werewolf eating some dude's face
On the racial aspect of Obsessed, as a white guy, I don't have too much to add. Still, I can't help but think race played into the reaction Ta-Nehesi talked about. I was living in Chicago when it came out that Michael Jordan had an affair with, as it happens, a white woman. An African-American female columnist for the Sun Times wrote an article about how she & all her African-American female friends we upset by the affair. Their biggest problem, she wrote, was not that Jordan--who every kid in Chicago idolized--cheated on his wife. It was that he cheated with a white woman.
Obviously this is anecdotal, but that stuck me as an extremely bizzare reaction, to say the least.
If you wish to solve the riddle that struck you as extremely bizarre, you have only to note several centuries of denigrating Black female sexuality and femininity. Add in a few more generations of contentious resentment between Black female laborers and their white (often female) employers, and you might find yourself coming round the mountain, as it were.
String should have known better than to be in the same room alone with the whip cream bikini girl from Varsity Blues. That turned out badly for Dawson too. But then String should have known better than to come clean to Avon about the "life he snatched".
Haven't seen the movie, will probably wait until cable, but when I saw the trailer my first thoughts ran to the race dynamic. Maybe that says more about me than about the movie.
On the positive side, it looks like String managed to turn on the fund faucet.
Storm's question (far up the thread) about white people at movies mostly answers itself: we act like we're in church, and you know how that goes.
I've encountered exceptions in small theaters on college campuses.
Also, on the question of white women standing and cheering, the women around me stayed seated but raised their voices at the end of "Thelma and Louise" and "Kill Bill."
Interesting POV.
I would argue in a nation where portrayals of black women are rarely, if ever, three-dimensional, where white women are idealized nearly all the time, black women's reactions to any white woman's comeuppance in a film is understandable, even if it is still disturbing. I don't think understanding what that is and being disturbed by it at the same time is impossible.
I think your response to Waiting to Exhale and your post here reveals how starkly gendered our conception of racism is. So often the violence of black men is understood, rationalized, explained. And it should be. That black women might also have a propensity for violence in the face of a society that loathes them is harder for us. This is a problem.
To focus on white women as victims here without acknowledging this history is deeply problematic and, I would argue, dangerous. It reinscribes gendered racist notions of black women - which I don't believe is your intention - that should be interrogated.
We have to, as a nation, unpack our understanding of racism. Particularly as it relates to black women. Black women are rarely if ever desired in public spaces, esp. in entertainment. And if they are, its usually after they've been "broken" in some way. Sure this film and Waiting to Exhale are terrible, awful films for a whole host of reasons, but that black women respond to instances where black women assert themselves says more about how rarely we see such a thing happen at all.
Not to be arrogant, but it's worth considering where this convo is taking place. We've spent a solid third of this week talking about history and race. I think that allows for some honest appraisals.
The Onion's AV Club had a great interview with Alfre Woodard this week that touches on some of these issues of trying to portray complex characters as a black actress. (And a mom.)
It's here:
http://www.avclub.com/articles/alfre-woodard,27224/
In closing, Alfre Woodard is awesome.
I don't mean to suggest you don't engage race, I just meant this post was one-sided in a way that I find problematic. That said, I think this was a reactionary piece - and that's fine - but it's worth nothing that often are first responses in America lean white, not black.
Sorry...that's "worth noting" not "worth nothing"
Samuel Jackson's wife had been killed in a car accident with her WHITE male boss who Jackson suspected she was having an affair with. This was suppossed to explain some of Jacksons' visceral hatred of the new inter-racial couple next door.
My loathing of Beyonce prevents me from ever purchasing a ticket for this.
But, for those that went to see it, of my non-Beyonce liking crowd..
yeah, they went to see Snowflake get the beatdown.
And for Idris Elba.
Those were the only two reasons I heard for going.
Cosigning Rikyrah.
And when I went to see Waiting To Exhale, the audience gave Angela Bassett an standing ovation as well. And it was clear that it was because she slapped the shit out of that white girl. Period.
What Tiffany said.
I also can't stand Beyonce---even though she is fine as hell. And ditto on the Snowflake beatdown.
I don't loathe her..I just think she needs to sit down somewhere. Why does she have to be in EVERY movie playing EVERY character? Given that there are soo many wonderful black actresses out there, I need to see more of them. Not more of her.
If I watch this movie it will be because of Idris. That's a strong IF.
Nice post as always from TNC.
I think this other post I read offers an equally interesting take on the movie: http://socialsciencelite.blogspot.com/2009/04/obsessed-with-what.html
$12.50!!!! Oh heeeeeeeecccckkkk naw! (sorry..movies are still an affordable $10 here in SF Bay Area)
I think part of it may be that black women have had to take a lot of crap from white women historically. Especially in the work world. And one really can't "fight back" against stuff like that without going to HR. Which in the end, you lose some respect because you have to go to someone else to fight your battle, protect you, etc. So, while I could be way off, I think it speaks to the desire to not get pushed around and stand up for oneself. But apparently, sounds like someone gets to put the smack down. This is a rare occurrence, so....the refrain to a Whitney song starts to play in my head...
Of course, Taraji Henson couldn't get to do this. Oh no. But Beyonce can.....shakes head.....
"Reference to Whitney song refrain"
...it's not right...but it's ok....
sorry, couldn't help it...
I'm surprised that we haven't talked much about the fact that this animosity/competition for men among women is a really useful way to keep us preoccupied with the sexism we ALL experience. Yes, white women are idealized in ways black women never are, and as a black woman, it gets old. But is the goal in life simply to be admired by men? Maybe neither white women nor black women should cherish the opinions of men quite so much...
MAYBE you're stuck on race? Heh heh, good one! Obsessed is so obviously race bait, and I'm not too mad that people went for that. I actually think that more people might have gone to see Beyonce catfight.
Wow, way to wave the bloody shirt, filmmakers.
Even if there's no actual affair with Ali Larter, the film is still playing to deep-seated racial fears of white women stealing black men. If there was a similar movie made with a white couple, where a black man is obsessed with and pursues the white wife, would anyone doubt it's incendiary? Clearly, this doesn't have the same historical context, but it's a similar idea, if lesser in magnitude of fear.
I avoid Beyonce movies at all costs, BUT, did want to put in a word for Waiting to Exhale and white girl/black girl race relations. As a white woman who has dated/loved black men, I was touched by the story line later in the movie where Wesley Snipes and Angela Basset meet in the bar and get drunk and "deeply connect", and then she finds out he is married to a white woman who is heroically dying of cancer, and he does not apologize for that, and then Angela Bassett is all, "Hey, maybe I don't hate all white girls after all." It was kinda sweet.
Speaking of:
a) crappy movies
b) racist movies
I'd like to revisit Gran Torino.
Not only was this movie a) crappy b) racist, it was c) unexplainably beloved by a contingent of critics and fans alike. Some claim that bad acting derailed a decent story, but in my book, the plot was lame and predictable, and bad acting just made the agony even more excrutiating. I actually wanted to punch Clint Eastwood in the face and demand my $10 back.
Seriously? Hated it?
And here I liked the movie. I know it touched on the sensitivity between the racists, but I didn't think it was necessarily a racist movie. My race radar must be off, because I'm not picking up on any of these black/white, race/racist issues that seem to be so easily detected by everyone else. lol
Never heard much about this rift between black and white women, according to Bill Maher, all women hate each other. Then again, probably not a wise thing to take advise from Bill Maher about women.
I wonder if this is similar to the Dirty Harry/Death Wish/70's cop shows. Crime in that era was seen as getting out of control, and white people cheered Clint breaking out his Magnum and blowing away thugs. Race was definitely in play in some if not a lot of these shows.
As for the blond aspect, white people do a lot of blond bashing with the lengthy list of lame blond jokes or the phrase "blond moment".
As a blond white woman, I gotta say I really do not take offense if black women want to go to a movie and cheer when a black chick beats down a slutty blond white chick who is trying to steal her man. When they start cheering when a black chick beats down a fairly inoffensive blond white chick who is, say, quietly typing comments on TNC's blog on her laptop, that's when I'll start worrying.
Hi Lee, a co-blondie here.
So this film is a remake of Fatal Attraction? It sure sounds as if everybody has forgotten the feminist critique about that film, after it first came out. It was a highly convenient vehicle for a lot of sexist crap, with Glenn Close in the role of unmarried psycho bitch. Fatal Attraction delved into the psyche of unmarried successful career women, who, it transpired in that film, must be crazy and violent. A deep well of blatant sexism was opened up there.
Obsessed has not reached Europe yet, so I am judging from the trailer only. But it sure sounds as if that particular sexism debate has only moved backward. The psycho unmarried blonde in the remake looks as if she has become even more weird and emotionally unstable than the original character, who at least had some real sex with Michael Douglas to back up her 'claim'. Also, the power dynamic is even more screwed up. Glenn Close's character was a professional woman, working in publishing, if I remember correctly. Her character twenty-odd-years on has no power in the workplace at all, and works as a temp.
As for the black and white woman dynamic, I feel too European and sheltered from the American experience to be knowledgeable enough to comment.
Her character twenty-odd-years on has no power in the workplace at all, and works as a temp.
I think that she apparently has no power is part of the point, you take someone who appears at the bottom of the ladder and through deviousness, she gains control. There would be a whole different dynamic if the woman was an equal or even a superior to the man (and a different comparison to an equally awful movie "Disclosure")
While there may have been a feminist critique of Fatal Attraction, it doesn't mean that filmmakers are going to change things. Stories of the vixen tempting a man predate the Bible. These kinds of stories happen in the workplace every day, though with less Hollywood sensationalism. Replace business exec with President of the United State, Temp with Intern, add a cigar and you have a real life movie. White House flunkies even had whisper campaigns that Monica was a nutty stalker a la Glenn Close.
I saw the posters on bus shelters and knew that, Idris Elba or no Idris Elba, I'd never see that movie. I'm going leave it to black people to decide whether it's speaking in crude code to black women, but I can tell you that it's speaking in crude code to men and women in general.
TO MEN: Crazy but hot temptress will get obsessed with you and ruin your life with nice and hot woman.
TO WOMEN: Crazy bitch will get obsessed with your man and try to steal him from you.
I saw "Fatal Attraction" once, and that was enough.
I find it interesting that folks are worried about a white woman being smacked around in movie by a black woman. When the same folks that saw this movie, most likely sat through The Family That Preys, where a black woman gets smacked head over heels by a black man. The way this was set-up in this film, folks were cheering this beatdown as well.
I sat through This Christmas, where Regina King beats the daylights out her cheating-ass black husband and that too, was greeted with healthy clapping and cheers. And quite frankly, Tyler Perry is a regular offender with this kind of stuff. From Jill Scott smacking her mean husbands with a bottle upside the head to throwing hot grits on someone.
The wrong question has been raised here. What difference does it make who is beaten? The real question is why are these kind of domestic violence movies being made and marketed to black folks in the first damn place? And why do some black folks enjoy seeing these kinds of movies?
Ah and a light bulb goes off. You have presented a very good question.
I saw each of the movies that you referenced and you're correct - when the black-on-black-beatdowns were going down, no one was complaining or muttering a single "What tha heck?" Especially when Sanaa was slapped over a counter in The Family That Preys. I mean come on - he hit her so hard she went up and over a counter?! The theater just laughed and gave that man his free pass and honorary Ike Turner club card.
My guess is that these violent portrayals are against people who have done wrong and are getting their "comeuppance" so to speak.
Jill Scott's husband was an ass! He made her get off of a plane and drive across the country while he had an affair in front of her friends. Not to mention the emotional abuse he heaped on her.
Regina King's husband? Another cheater who was emotionally abusive.
Sanaa Lathan ( I haven't seen the movie..) but from what I can gather of Tyler Perry's movies, she must have been an evil character in some way. Rarely does he let someone just be abusive without cause.
Here's the thing, I think movies allow people to exact retribution in violent ways that aren't really acceptable in normal society. Not to say that there isn't a problem with this. Movies are too violent in general. However, it is a good observation that for these movies it seems it is okay to offer up violence is an acceptable answer to solving your problems to the Black Community.
As Peggy Noonan said, sometimes it's best to keep on walking: look forward, don't look back.
It should be noted that the same guys who did 'Trois' (fellow FAMU Alums Will Packer and Rob Hardy) did this movie also.
Sould help explain alot of the similarities.
Ah no wonder.
Where are all these people who idealize white women? All the white guys I know seem to be marrying Asian women. Or Latinas.
Which is fine if they are doing it for the right reasons. The ones who say they like these women because they have "better family values," I drop even as casual friends. It seems to be a code for wanting a traditional, pre-feminist woman who won't make waves.
(Knowing some of the women, these men will be surprised.)
I am surprised that none of the commenters have brought up an obvious point- Black women are the ultimate underclass of American society. Everywhere we turn, our beauty, desirability, femininity and character are being disparaged by comparison to the mainstream, excessively thin, blonde-hair blue-eyed ideal. We have too much attitude, our natural hair is too short or too kinky, our thighs are too thick, our butts are too big, etc. I have seen a focus group of White women on CNN publicly compare Michelle Obama to a horse because of the shape of her figure! So why is everyone surprised and offended that Black women take it personally when the most successful Black men chose a White wife? We have come to harden ourselves to being marginalized by mainstream White society but it hurts even more, on a much more intimate level, coming from one of our own. Instead of begrudging the Black women in the audience the cathartic release of seeing an errant White adulteress put in place by a strong Black woman, perhaps we should question the type of society that inspires these type of feelings.